Fane 15" full range speaker

Dedicated to those large boxes at one end of the room
Post Reply
User avatar
ed
retired
Posts: 5384
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2007 4:01 pm
Location: yorkshire
Contact:

#61 Re: Fane 15" full range speaker

Post by ed »

Cressy Snr wrote: Mon Jun 18, 2018 2:04 pm
Aye, If I don't get the 15's done in time, we can always have a meet in the Autumn with the 15's; maybe with Ed's 12's if he gets them built.

Good tech conversation with Scott last Friday too.
The moment I get these two amps knocked into shape and the monitors tuned I will be all over it. So far I'm looking at a trapezoid section so I don't have to worry about the standing waves so much(he smiled a mischievous grin). Most important for me at the mo is floor standing with main driver at ear height. Of course all with the house trim birch and mahogany.
fane 12_250 sealed.jpg
diet +1 for the Scott input...it's invaluable
There's nowhere you can be that isn't where you're meant to be
User avatar
Nick
Site Admin
Posts: 15707
Joined: Sun May 06, 2007 10:20 am
Location: West Yorkshire

#62 Re: Fane 15" full range speaker

Post by Nick »

The "Golden Ratio" refers to the ideal ratio for height, width, and depth of a speaker cab, to reduce internal standing waves.

The ratio is 0.6 :1.0 : 1.6
Ok, why?

Without spending too much time thinking, I would have thought that ratios that were prime would have been better to avoid the same harmonics in more than one direction. say 3 : 5 : 7 (0.6 : 1 : 1.4), or 3 : 5 : 9 (0.6 : 1 : 1.8)
Whenever an honest man discovers that he's mistaken, he will either cease to be mistaken or he will cease to be honest.
User avatar
IslandPink
Amstrad Tower of Power
Posts: 10041
Joined: Tue May 29, 2007 7:01 pm
Location: Denbigh, N.Wales

#63 Re: Fane 15" full range speaker

Post by IslandPink »

Hang on ... isn't this golden ration thing about making sure the resonances wehre present are favourable harmonically .. rather than being 'enharmonic' or whatever the word is ?
I haven't looked into it much but it just rang some sort of bell in the distant memory banks.
"Once you find out ... the Circumstances ; then you can go out"
Cressy Snr
Amstrad Tower of Power
Posts: 10552
Joined: Wed May 30, 2007 12:25 am
Location: South Yorks.

#64 Re: Fane 15" full range speaker

Post by Cressy Snr »

Nick wrote: Mon Jun 18, 2018 4:40 pm
The "Golden Ratio" refers to the ideal ratio for height, width, and depth of a speaker cab, to reduce internal standing waves.

The ratio is 0.6 :1.0 : 1.6
Ok, why?

Without spending too much time thinking, I would have thought that ratios that were prime would have been better to avoid the same harmonics in more than one direction. say 3 : 5 : 7 (0.6 : 1 : 1.4), or 3 : 5 : 9 (0.6 : 1 : 1.8 )
Nick...I just do it because tradition tells me to. I had to regroup somehow with speakers, so I'm building rectangular and trying to keep my head down.

"Q" did cause a bit of recent mischief but is now (hopefully) safely back in the continuum, having had his bit of fun. :)

The results of going back to the 60s with speakers seem to work well. The sound is unerringly tuneful and nothing jars or seems wrong musically.
Sgt. Baker started talkin’ with a Bullhorn in his hand.
User avatar
Nick
Site Admin
Posts: 15707
Joined: Sun May 06, 2007 10:20 am
Location: West Yorkshire

#65 Re: Fane 15" full range speaker

Post by Nick »

Ok, I guess its because its a irrational number so you are unlikely to find a frequency that is a harmonic of more than one path. Though making them rational numbers like 1.6 instead of 1.618... might make it less effective.
Whenever an honest man discovers that he's mistaken, he will either cease to be mistaken or he will cease to be honest.
User avatar
Nick
Site Admin
Posts: 15707
Joined: Sun May 06, 2007 10:20 am
Location: West Yorkshire

#66 Re: Fane 15" full range speaker

Post by Nick »

I think my prime idea is rubbish BTW, there would be shared harmonics.
Whenever an honest man discovers that he's mistaken, he will either cease to be mistaken or he will cease to be honest.
User avatar
Nick
Site Admin
Posts: 15707
Joined: Sun May 06, 2007 10:20 am
Location: West Yorkshire

#67 Re: Fane 15" full range speaker

Post by Nick »

Just wrote some code, if you use rational numbers there are matching harmonics. so using 0.6 : 1 : 1.6

1/L1 = 1.666667, 1/L2 = 1.000000, 1/L3 = 0.625000

3 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 5 harmonic of L2
6 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 10 harmonic of L2
9 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 15 harmonic of L2
12 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 20 harmonic of L2
15 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 25 harmonic of L2
18 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 30 harmonic of L2
21 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 35 harmonic of L2
24 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 40 harmonic of L2
27 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 45 harmonic of L2
30 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 50 harmonic of L2
33 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 55 harmonic of L2
36 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 60 harmonic of L2
39 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 65 harmonic of L2
42 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 70 harmonic of L2
45 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 75 harmonic of L2
48 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 80 harmonic of L2
51 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 85 harmonic of L2
54 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 90 harmonic of L2
57 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 95 harmonic of L2
3 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 8 harmonic of L3
6 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 16 harmonic of L3
9 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 24 harmonic of L3
12 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 32 harmonic of L3
15 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 40 harmonic of L3
18 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 48 harmonic of L3
21 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 56 harmonic of L3
24 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 64 harmonic of L3
27 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 72 harmonic of L3
30 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 80 harmonic of L3
33 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 88 harmonic of L3
36 harmonic of L1 is the same as the 96 harmonic of L3
5 harmonic of L2 is the same as the 8 harmonic of L3
10 harmonic of L2 is the same as the 16 harmonic of L3
15 harmonic of L2 is the same as the 24 harmonic of L3
20 harmonic of L2 is the same as the 32 harmonic of L3
25 harmonic of L2 is the same as the 40 harmonic of L3
30 harmonic of L2 is the same as the 48 harmonic of L3
35 harmonic of L2 is the same as the 56 harmonic of L3
40 harmonic of L2 is the same as the 64 harmonic of L3
45 harmonic of L2 is the same as the 72 harmonic of L3
50 harmonic of L2 is the same as the 80 harmonic of L3
55 harmonic of L2 is the same as the 88 harmonic of L3
60 harmonic of L2 is the same as the 96 harmonic of L3
10 harmonic of L2 is the same as the 16 harmonic of L3 and is the same as the 6 harmonic of L1
15 harmonic of L2 is the same as the 24 harmonic of L3 and is the same as the 9 harmonic of L1
20 harmonic of L2 is the same as the 32 harmonic of L3 and is the same as the 12 harmonic of L1
25 harmonic of L2 is the same as the 40 harmonic of L3 and is the same as the 15 harmonic of L1
30 harmonic of L2 is the same as the 48 harmonic of L3 and is the same as the 18 harmonic of L1
35 harmonic of L2 is the same as the 56 harmonic of L3 and is the same as the 21 harmonic of L1
40 harmonic of L2 is the same as the 64 harmonic of L3 and is the same as the 24 harmonic of L1
45 harmonic of L2 is the same as the 72 harmonic of L3 and is the same as the 27 harmonic of L1
50 harmonic of L2 is the same as the 80 harmonic of L3 and is the same as the 30 harmonic of L1
55 harmonic of L2 is the same as the 88 harmonic of L3 and is the same as the 33 harmonic of L1
60 harmonic of L2 is the same as the 96 harmonic of L3 and is the same as the 36 harmonic of L1

Just thinking out loud.
Whenever an honest man discovers that he's mistaken, he will either cease to be mistaken or he will cease to be honest.
User avatar
IslandPink
Amstrad Tower of Power
Posts: 10041
Joined: Tue May 29, 2007 7:01 pm
Location: Denbigh, N.Wales

#68 Re: Fane 15" full range speaker

Post by IslandPink »

Let's hope someone who plays a piano is reading all that.
"Once you find out ... the Circumstances ; then you can go out"
User avatar
andrew Ivimey
Social Sevices have been notified
Posts: 8307
Joined: Mon Jun 11, 2007 8:33 am
Location: Bedford

#69 Re: Fane 15" full range speaker

Post by andrew Ivimey »

I read it but it doesn't help (me).
Philosophers have only interpreted the world - the point, however, is to change it. No it isn't ... maybe we should leave it alone for a while.
User avatar
ed
retired
Posts: 5384
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2007 4:01 pm
Location: yorkshire
Contact:

#70 Re: Fane 15" full range speaker

Post by ed »

I read it, I lost hope after line 3, hope doesn't help.
There's nowhere you can be that isn't where you're meant to be
User avatar
Scottmoose
Needs to get out more
Posts: 1802
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2007 11:03 am
Contact:

#71 Re: Fane 15" full range speaker

Post by Scottmoose »

For what it's worth, it was Thiele who was largely responsible for popularising golden ratio for speaker cabinets back in the early - mid '70s. Nominally it spreads the eigenmodes / reduces their build-up. It's not the only option of course, pretty much any irrational number basis can be used as an alternative, it's just the best known one from architecture &c. Can be applied internally or externally to the box. Nice if you can, & doesn't hurt, although it's not likely to provide a make / break difference either.
'"That'll do," comes the cry of the perfectionist down the ages.' (James May The Reassembler)
Website www.wodendesign.com
Community sites www.frugal-horn.com & www.frugal-phile.com
User avatar
Nick
Site Admin
Posts: 15707
Joined: Sun May 06, 2007 10:20 am
Location: West Yorkshire

#72 Re: Fane 15" full range speaker

Post by Nick »

Scottmoose wrote: Tue Jun 19, 2018 8:20 am For what it's worth, it was Thiele who was largely responsible for popularising golden ratio for speaker cabinets back in the early - mid '70s. Nominally it spreads the eigenmodes / reduces their build-up. It's not the only option of course, pretty much any irrational number basis can be used as an alternative, it's just the best known one from architecture &c. Can be applied internally or externally to the box. Nice if you can, & doesn't hurt, although it's not likely to provide a make / break difference either.
That makes sense. Thanks. I could see the point of a irrational number, but didn't see why that particular one was special.
Whenever an honest man discovers that he's mistaken, he will either cease to be mistaken or he will cease to be honest.
User avatar
pre65
Amstrad Tower of Power
Posts: 21373
Joined: Wed Aug 22, 2007 11:13 pm
Location: North Essex/Suffolk border.

#73 Re: Fane 15" full range speaker

Post by pre65 »

I'll look forward to Ants builds at Owston. :lol:
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.

Edmund Burke

G-Popz THE easy listening connoisseur. (Philip)
Ant
Shed dweller
Posts: 2332
Joined: Mon Jul 31, 2017 6:45 pm
Location: Yorkshire

#74 Re: Fane 15" full range speaker

Post by Ant »

Won't be there phil
Also starring Rex Hamilton as Abraham Lincoln

www.bte-designs.weebly.com
Ant
Shed dweller
Posts: 2332
Joined: Mon Jul 31, 2017 6:45 pm
Location: Yorkshire

#75 Re: Fane 15" full range speaker

Post by Ant »

built a fridge freezer

ImageObscenely large sealed boxes...... by anthony cresswell, on Flickr
Also starring Rex Hamilton as Abraham Lincoln

www.bte-designs.weebly.com
Post Reply