Cannibalizing Speakers for New Experiments

Dedicated to those large boxes at one end of the room
Post Reply
JohnG
Old Hand
Posts: 418
Joined: Sat Mar 25, 2017 10:59 am

#1 Cannibalizing Speakers for New Experiments

Post by JohnG »

Hi Again
I have taken the plunge and bought a used pair of speakers. The Drivers are from Audax HD-3P, HM130CO, HM210CO.
The enclosure is much larger than the usual size these drivers are witnessed in.
The cross overs are external to the cabinets and all components are visible behind a mesh covered recess on the cabinets rear panel.
I am hoping to use the drivers on these speakers to do some experiments with various speaker types, hopefully starting with the simplist of
constructions, being a OB.
Does any forum members know of a OB set up working with drivers like these ?
How complicated would it be, to get these drivers to work on a OB.
Would the Eminence Beta 15 still be the recommended Bass Driver ?
Being a numpty with electronic assemblies, I was thinking I could use the exposed cross over on the cabinets to be the cross over for the OB,
or am I now supplying too much entertainment with my ideas.

John
chris661
Shed dweller
Posts: 2556
Joined: Mon Feb 22, 2010 7:29 am
Location: Sheffield

#2 Re: Cannibalizing Speakers for New Experiments

Post by chris661 »

Looks like you've got an 8" bass driver there.
I've tried 8"s on narrow baffles for OB bass, and it's just not going to cut it for anything other than a nearfield desktop system. I'd still aim for 15"s, or maybe a pair of 12"s.

Chris
User avatar
pre65
Amstrad Tower of Power
Posts: 21373
Joined: Wed Aug 22, 2007 11:13 pm
Location: North Essex/Suffolk border.

#3 Re: Cannibalizing Speakers for New Experiments

Post by pre65 »

You were given details of a really good OB speaker, but have chosen to go your own way.

Good luck. :)
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.

Edmund Burke

G-Popz THE easy listening connoisseur. (Philip)
User avatar
Greg
Social outcast
Posts: 3198
Joined: Wed May 23, 2007 11:14 am
Location: Bristol, UK

#4 Re: Cannibalizing Speakers for New Experiments

Post by Greg »

Yep, those drivers are used in WAD KLS3. John has also posed a question on the WD forum which was replied to. No response to that either.
User avatar
pre65
Amstrad Tower of Power
Posts: 21373
Joined: Wed Aug 22, 2007 11:13 pm
Location: North Essex/Suffolk border.

#5 Re: Cannibalizing Speakers for New Experiments

Post by pre65 »

Just to say the Fostex speakers as used on Nicks that I have are now sold.

To a forum member who wants to recreate Nicks OBs. :)
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.

Edmund Burke

G-Popz THE easy listening connoisseur. (Philip)
SimonC
Old Hand
Posts: 545
Joined: Mon Sep 24, 2007 11:34 am
Location: West Yorkshire

#6 Re: Cannibalizing Speakers for New Experiments

Post by SimonC »

JohnG wrote: Thu Apr 13, 2017 5:36 pm Hi Again
I have taken the plunge and bought a used pair of speakers. The Drivers are from Audax HD-3P, HM130CO, HM210CO.
The enclosure is much larger than the usual size these drivers are witnessed in.
The cross overs are external to the cabinets and all components are visible behind a mesh covered recess on the cabinets rear panel.
I am hoping to use the drivers on these speakers to do some experiments with various speaker types, hopefully starting with the simplist of
constructions, being a OB.
Does any forum members know of a OB set up working with drivers like these ?
How complicated would it be, to get these drivers to work on a OB.
Would the Eminence Beta 15 still be the recommended Bass Driver ?
Being a numpty with electronic assemblies, I was thinking I could use the exposed cross over on the cabinets to be the cross over for the OB,
or am I now supplying too much entertainment with my ideas.

John
Hi John,

I know those drivers well, as Greg said they are from a WAD KLS3. The two carbon coned drivers are a great basis for a number of different options, but they are unlikely to be at their best on a pure OB without a lot of work. Can't go far wrong with a 15" Eminence beta on an OB baffle for bass, the dimensions for Nick's OB are on the forum in a couple of places. Use those dimensions as a starting point and you won't go far wrong...but mating them to the audax drivers may be a challenge. OB's using the Beta seem to sound at their best with a series cross-over, and marrying a series cross-over into this mix of drivers would be character building.

My suggestion (and its only a suggestion): if the HD-3P's are fully working, wrinkle free and don't show any signs of dome collapse then sell them asap. Use the money to buy a nice, easy to work with tweeter that will last a lifetime. The 3P's may look awesome, but they are notoriously unreliable and are worthless once the wrinkles start appearing.
Beyond that its more a case of how much time you have, and how much you want to learn along the way. If you want a quick build thats going to give known results then sell the lot and build a clone of Nick's OB. If you have plenty of time and patience then acquire a pair of large drivers (there are lots that work well in OB's), some wood and figure out how to make an OB work with that combination of drivers.

Alternatively, you could use them to build a tweaked KLS3, things have moved on since the original design was done and there are plenty of suggestions on various forums about how to improve the design to get the best out of those drivers. For a floor standing 3-way speaker it takes a lot to better a good KLS3. (But I'm biased, I'm a KLS3 fanboy).

Rgs
Simon C
User avatar
Greg
Social outcast
Posts: 3198
Joined: Wed May 23, 2007 11:14 am
Location: Bristol, UK

#7 Re: Cannibalizing Speakers for New Experiments

Post by Greg »

+1.
JohnG
Old Hand
Posts: 418
Joined: Sat Mar 25, 2017 10:59 am

#8 Re: Cannibalizing Speakers for New Experiments

Post by JohnG »

Thank you for taking the time to share your thoughts,

It would seem that I have chosen a speaker with a good selection of drivers than can be used in other designs, even though not best suited to some of my ideas. I have been recently been offered the loan on a 8" Tang Band, 8" Fostex and 8" Seas full range drivers, so the OB experiments will be well supported when they start, My friend is a Horn user and has a expressed a interest in my OB curiosity. I hope to hear Alpairs while at the June Show.

I would like to share with you, another speaker that I have been introduced to and offered a home loan,the brand is not common to the UK,
it is the BLack Swift Model 1333, this employs a Seas Co -incident driver with Bass being produced from a BVR enclosure. All I can say is the listiening experience is very good with a very memorable lucid mid range presentation.

I have arrived home a little while ago with the speakers, seven hour round trip,what would we do with out Holiday Traffic.
The cabinets to these new speakers are five sided, the front face will toe in when the rear face is parallel to a wall.
The width being 400mm and the longest front to back Dims being 400mm, with a height of 930mm. Each cabinet weighs about 40Kgs.
The Cabinet design is a deviation from a KLS3.
The cross overs are mounted on the external face of the rear panel, Solens and Musicaps are visible.
The HD-3P has lost gas, I will attempt a DIY refil, I know there is a way to do it, it has a inlet hidden behind the ID sticker on the rear face,I have read a article on this. If this does not work, I can contact Moca Audio as a option, this service will supply a device to anable any further needs to add gas/air
A replacement tweeter is also a option, but £400 for Seas Milleenium "umm ??"
More importantly, I am now in possession of a speaker that will surpass my cheapo Tannoy M2.5, I can still carry on with my plan to make a OB Sub Woofer using the Eminence Beta 15. Then progress to creating a Full Range OB after hearing some versions in June at Owston.
My 2017, full of experimentation and auditions of others work, is in full swing. I,m looking forward to sharing my new discoveries.
Apologies for my so called unresponsivness, the loss of a loved family member this week has caused all sorts of mental comprehension on all things.
User avatar
pre65
Amstrad Tower of Power
Posts: 21373
Joined: Wed Aug 22, 2007 11:13 pm
Location: North Essex/Suffolk border.

#9 Re: Cannibalizing Speakers for New Experiments

Post by pre65 »

JohnG wrote: Fri Apr 14, 2017 4:21 pm


Apologies for my so called unresponsivness, the loss of a loved family member this week has caused all sorts of mental comprehension on all things.
My condolences John. :(
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.

Edmund Burke

G-Popz THE easy listening connoisseur. (Philip)
User avatar
Greg
Social outcast
Posts: 3198
Joined: Wed May 23, 2007 11:14 am
Location: Bristol, UK

#10 Re: Cannibalizing Speakers for New Experiments

Post by Greg »

Yes, from me as well. That makes it very understandable.

If you plan to use these KLS3 derivatives, I do wonder what you are expecting a sub woofer to achieve. Is it for a cinema system?
JohnG
Old Hand
Posts: 418
Joined: Sat Mar 25, 2017 10:59 am

#11 Re: Cannibalizing Speakers for New Experiments

Post by JohnG »

The purpose of the Sub Woofer is to build a OB, learn a little about cross overs, and use the OB Sub Woofer in a future OB Full Range Speaker. [/img]
Post Reply