PCBs

ed · Post by ed » Tue Mar 25, 2014 1:31 pm

I'm pretty sure this has been discussed before but I couldn't find any mention.

I'm about to do the updated version of the digital/analog pre-amp that I did a while back...it's quite complicated wiring wise, and the new version even more so, so I thought it's probably time to try and get my head around pcb making.

I currently use expressSCH/expressPCB but have only used the schematic bit. I'm just investigating the pcb and manufacturing side of it at the moment. I've had designspark loaded in the past but didn't get beyond basic schematics. From memory designspark had better default libraries than expressSCH

Does anybody have any tips or recommendations for a package that allows drawing schematics and then converting to pcb layout for manufacture. I'm only looking for 2 layer boards, and possibly the supply of one-offs for final testing.

This has got to be on the road to madness.....

Andrew · Post by **Andrew** » Tue Mar 25, 2014 7:30 pm

For small boards Eagle is free and is full featured; the limit is simply size and it should handle those sizes fine.

Andrew

Ray P · Post by **Ray P** » Tue Mar 25, 2014 7:31 pm

I'm in a similar place Ed.

I gave Eagle a try but it was just to time consuming to do basic things; I know it's very good but the learning curve is steep and to much of an investment for my requirements, which are similar to your own I think.

At the other end of the scale ExpressPCB is really very simple to use to produce basic PCBs; the downside is the tie in to their expensive manufacturing. I've produced some PCBs layouts in ExpressPCB but I'm currently checking out Copper Connection; easy to use and it will read ExpressPCB files; for a small outlay (less than $50) you can get a version that will produce gerber etc. output files That'll give the choice of working in ExpressPCB or Copper Connection and then producing outputs to send to any PCB manufacturer with Copper Connection. I think the cost of Copper Connection will be offset with the reduced cost of the first order by avoiding ExpressPCB prices.

Ray

ed · Post by ed » Tue Mar 25, 2014 7:51 pm

Thanks Ray...

I like expressSCH and I like the description of how to link to expressPCB, it looks very straightforward...The cost for 3 basic boards is $51 but I think the postage to UK is quite high....

but as I said, the libraries for designspark look better but I'm not sure about the link to the pcb side, and I'm not sure about board manufacture with designspark.....

or board manufacture with eagle

it's a challenge for sure....onward

Ray P · Post by **Ray P** » Tue Mar 25, 2014 8:01 pm

IN fact Ed, if I decide to shell out on Copper Connection I will be happy to convert a few ExpressPCB files...

Ray

Post by **Nick** » Tue Mar 25, 2014 8:03 pm

Once you have the gerber and hole files, then getting PCB's made is simple. PCB Train do a great one day service for a prototype, two sided plated through. If you want printing and solder masks, then it takes longer and costs more. If you want 50 or more making I would suggest Quick Tech.

You will be shocked just how simple it is once you have the gerbers.

http://www.pcbtrain.co.uk/

http://www.quick-teck.co.uk/index.php

ed · Post by ed » Tue Mar 25, 2014 8:17 pm

thanks Nick....

I'd looked at those sites but couldn't find any detail on the requirements, loads of calculators to say how much for this and that but no mention of what to send them.....

what I did find was that if you set the calculators for 1 board it gives much the same price as for 10 boards

so it's a gerber file that you have to send the fabricators?...they must assume that everybody that looks at their web sites already knows this.......

Am I right in guessing that expressPCB doesn't export gerber files, so you have to use their manufacturing process??

but the expressPCB quote for 3 small boards is cheaper than all the uk manufacturers I've seen so far....

edit: I've just found the gerber reference on the pcbtrain website....must pay more attention
also managed to get a realistic quote for 1 board 50mmx75mm at £44....
progress

Andrew · Post by **Andrew** » Tue Mar 25, 2014 8:36 pm

The boards I have done for the group buys uses pcbtrain for prototypes and quick teck for the final items.

Andrew

Mike H · Post by **Mike H** » Tue Mar 25, 2014 9:07 pm

FreePCB makes gerbers and can be made to import LTspice schematics.

There is the inevitable learning curve of course.

Ray P · Post by **Ray P** » Wed Mar 26, 2014 6:16 am

ed wrote:Am I right in guessing that expressPCB doesn't export gerber files, so you have to use their manufacturing process??

Yes, that's the tie in, though for a fee (I think it's around $60 per board) they will sell you a set of gerber files but only after they've processed an order to manufacture the board! I thought their shipping costs were very high too, especially when you consider most of these things will slip into a jiffy bag. The other thing to remember with ExpressPCB, compounded by their pricing, is that you may be invited to pay Her Majesty's Government another 20%, in which case the shipping company are likely to extort an additional fee for the privilege...

I'm planning to use PCBTrain for manufacture as recommended by Andrew.

Ray

Andrew · Post by **Andrew** » Wed Mar 26, 2014 7:24 am

Ray P wrote:
I'm planning to use PCBTrain for manufacture as recommended by Andrew.

Ray

Please thank Nick, I'm only acting on his recommendation.

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